Implementing Google News keywords as metatag & in sitemap

Resolved Aahan Krish
(@aahan)

9 years, 10 months ago
Related to: http://wordpress.org/support/topic/implementing-the-news_keywords-metatag

[VIEW THE IMAGE]

(W.r.t to image above.) Categories AND Tags are usually the direct keywords of an article. So, the use of a dropdown instead of a checkbox seems pointless to me. A checkbox would be better, but…

People and organizations use categories and tags differently. For example, they could be using categories to organize news and non-news items; tags could constitute unrelated keywords like “Highlights”, “Top Stories”, etc. used to organize content.

So, the optimal way, IMHO, would be:

1. Add a custom metabox (textfield) in the post editor to allow users to define comma-separated keywords that aren’t included in either categories or tags.

2. In the options screen, replace the dropdown with checkboxes. And these should be the options:
```
- Categories
- Tags
- Author-defined keywords (from Custom Field)
```
This way the user will be able to choose all, some, or none, depending on what suits his website. What do you think?

PS: Overall the plugin is simple and well-crafted. Thank you for that!

https://wordpress.org/plugins/xml-sitemap-feed/

Viewing 15 replies - 1 through 15 (of 15 total)

Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 10 months ago

Hi Aahan,

Thanks for your thoughts on this matter.

My considerations for not allowing both tags and categories to serve as News Keywords are:

1. News Keywords are not really keywords in the sense that keywords in the traditional sene are (or are similar to) words that are used in the article itself while News Keywords do not have to be in the article and seem to be used in a much broader way for categorisation of news. So in that sense, they are more like categories. See the article https://support.google.com/news/publisher/answer/116037?hl=en

2. Over time, most WordPress bloggers create an near unlimited amount of tags on their site. Not useful (for both readers and search engines) IMHO, but that’s just how the tag system is commonly used.

3. An large variaty of words as News Keywords is not helpful at all and will, if nothing else, only confuse Google News. I don’t think Google News will see it as spamming but still…

So to prevent bloggers from ‘abusing’ (in a nice way) News Keywords as most are used to do with the standard WordPress tags, I chose to set it the option to Categories by default. The Tags option is there only for those blogs that do not use Categories at all (while keeping the nubmer of tags limited, logical and sensible I hope!)…

I agree with you that it would be more flexible to allow usage of both Categories and Tags as News Keywords, but in my mind that is not the intended use of News Keywords. It might have been less confusing if Google had called them News Categories instead of News Keywords… More flexibility in the form of a metabox for author-defined News Keywords, would only add to the confusion in this respect.

However, if expert opinion says otherwise, I’m happy to revise on this train of thought 🙂

Rolf

Thread Starter Aahan Krish
(@aahan)

9 years, 10 months ago

Hi Rolf,

I think you are considering that both <news:keywords> and news_keywords are meant for the same purpose. That’s not true.

The <news:keywords> tag in the news sitemap is actually different from the news_keywords meta tag.

The meta tag is actually meant for keyword induction to help Google classify your content when the keywords within the content of the article can’t do it well enough. I’d like to direct you to this Google News help document: https://support.google.com/news/publisher/answer/68297?hl=en

Also, there’s a limit on the meta tag:

You can add up to ten phrases for a given article, and all keywords are given equal value.

So, what you said is more true for the <news:keywords> sitemap tag, rather than the news_keywords meta tag. BUT…

As said in the document you yourself linked to:

You may use other keywords not listed here; we recommend using English if possible.

Therefore, we can deduce that both news_keywords meta tag and <news:keywords> sitemap tag can be the same given that you are enforcing a combined limit of 10 keywords.

Let me know what you think now.

Thread Starter Aahan Krish
(@aahan)

9 years, 10 months ago

(Continued…) Now, you may ask me, if the <news:keywords> sitemap tag is not meant to be as outright as the news_keywords meta tag, why should they be the same?

Well, because it’d be a lot of work for news organizations to spend time adding two different sets of keywords for each article when they should be spending time on writing quality content.

You can also take a look at: http://mashable.com/sitemap-news.xml

I think when you are a Google News publisher, you are somewhat better trusted, and those thin lines don’t matter.

Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 10 months ago

I think you are considering that both <news:keywords> and news_keywords are meant for the same purpose. That’s not true.

Ah! Thanks for clearing that up 🙂

I had just found https://support.google.com/news/publisher/answer/68297?hl=en and was confused about the suggestions given there using terms like “World Cup, Brazil 2014, Spain vs Netherlands, soccer, football” in the example which seemed contrary to what is suggested on https://support.google.com/news/publisher/answer/116037?hl=en where much broader terms like “Business, Education, Sports” (even in a hierachical category like manner) are given as an example.

So that explains our different view. The option in the XML Sitemap settings controls the <news:keywords> tag, not any news_keywords meta tag as there is none in the plugin at this point.

I’m considering the news_keywords meta tag but it’s not implemented yet… And it might well get the option to include both Tags (default) and Categories and maybe even some metabox field or custom taxonomy. That does make sense 🙂

About the <news:keywords> tag, even if on https://support.google.com/news/publisher/answer/116037?hl=en it says:

You may use other keywords not listed here; we recommend using English if possible.

(which is not contrary the typical use of Categories since you can create an unlimited number of them, even from the post editor) and in the light of the examples given there, I still feel the intended usage is closest to that of Post Categories in WordPress.

Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 10 months ago

Well, because it’d be a lot of work for news organizations to spend time adding two different sets of keywords for each article when they should be spending time on writing quality content.

That is exactly why I’d like to keep the plugin options in check with standard WordPress taxonomies (Categories/Tags) and not add too much more options which only confuse and divert. Unless absolutely necessary of course 😉

Thread Starter Aahan Krish
(@aahan)

9 years, 10 months ago

Now that we agree about news_keywords meta tag, let me try to convince you about the <news:keywords> tag. 🙂

(You probably missed my earlier post, so here it goes again, with some minute changes.)

If the <news:keywords> sitemap tag is not meant to be as outright as the news_keywords meta tag in defining keywords relevant to the article, why should they be the same?

Well, because it’d be a lot of work for news organizations to spend time adding two different sets of keywords for each article when they should be spending time on writing quality content.

For examples, you can also take a look at:

– http://mashable.com/sitemap-news.xml
– http://www.theguardian.com/newssitemap.xml

None of these top news sites adhere to your policy of intended usage. They are just keywords, no different.

I think when you are a Google News publisher, you are somewhat better trusted, and those thin lines don’t matter.

Thread Starter Aahan Krish
(@aahan)

9 years, 10 months ago

… and not add too much more options which only confuse and divert. Unless absolutely necessary of course 😉

First, please make note of my previous post.

If you ask me, yes, keywords are very important for sites accepted into Google News, and it is a necessary confusion, if at all it’s one.

From what I know and read, the news_keywords meta tag helps Google show your article for relevant searches while the <news:keywords> sitemap tag is meant more for organizing your content among Google News categories AND to aid Google in showing your article for relevant searches (which is what keywords in general are meant for). Which is why I am stressing my point again and again.

Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 10 months ago

None of these top news sites adhere to your policy of intended usage.

It’s not my policy (you can choose Tags after all!) but the impression I get from the description given by Google. Now, I could argue that terms used by The Guardian (like Liberal Democrats, Politics, UK news, European elections… but I’ve not looked at them all!) are mostly in that same spirit but I cannot deny the usage by Mashable is far beyond categories and much more ‘taggy’.

Did you (or can you) find any word on this by Google News themselves? Other than the ambiguous documentation, I mean. I have the feeling there is more silence (by Google at least) than help given on the Product > News forums since my post about the disappearance of documentation on the <news:geo_locations> tag https://productforums.google.com/d/msg/news/CKXxnNdyVCU/AUVWk46L1WsJ has been ignored. I did find https://productforums.google.com/d/msg/news/Wl5zxYPW9kY/CbR8UnH8NqAJ but the only anwser there is a guess too…

Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 10 months ago

From what I know and read, the news_keywords meta tag helps Google show your article for relevant searches while the <news:keywords> sitemap tag is meant more for organizing your content among Google News categories…

Up to this point, I’m following in agreement but

… AND to aid Google in showing your article for relevant searches…

where did you read about that?

The doc on https://support.google.com/news/publisher/answer/116037 only says:

The <keywords> tag is used to help classify the articles you submit to Google News by topic.
Thread Starter Aahan Krish
(@aahan)

9 years, 10 months ago
where did you read about that?

Like I said, “which is what keywords in general are meant for”.

Now, I could argue that terms used by The Guardian (like Liberal Democrats, Politics, UK news, European elections… but I’ve not looked at them all!) are mostly in that same spirit…

W.r.t the emphasized text, yes, you are right. Here, I have a bad example for you:
```
<news:keywords>
  Dawn of the Planet of the Apes, Andy Serkis, Science fiction and fantasy, Action and adventure, Film, Culture
</news:keywords>
```
See, I am trying to be realistic about the implementation of this feature. I understand you want to keep it simple. But separating news_keywords meta tag and <news:keywords> sitemap tag by providing two separate meta boxes will only confuse people more.

OTOH, using categories or tags alone to simply things is useless. I’d leave the choice to the users with a note and links to the two docs we’ve constantly been referring each other to; but I’m not the developer. 😉

Three checkboxes instead of a dropdown and the choice is left to the user:
```
- Categories
- Tags
- Author-defined keywords (from Custom Field)
```
If you still don’t agree with my point, it’s fine by me. I’ll hack through the plugin’s code and implement this for myself (I am not good with code but I can get stuff done 😛 ). I just want to know your stand on this.
Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 10 months ago

But separating news_keywords meta tag and <news:keywords> sitemap tag by providing two separate meta boxes will only confuse people more.

I have no intention of doing such a thing 🙂

Question: why would you need an extra meta box for author defined keywords at all? If you want to include Post Tags already, then that field can serve the exact same purpose…

I’ll consider your stance on the possibility to include both Categories and Tags. I’m not opposed to choice, please do not mistake my reasons for not programming this in the beginning for being against choice 😉 But creating one or (let alone) more extra meta fields for this purpose seems redundant. The flexibility you seem to be looking for is already available in WordPress itself.

PPDPurveyor
(@peoples_pundit)

9 years, 8 months ago

I understand the plugin author’s argument. However, <news:keywords> XML tag simply helps Google appropriately characterize where in Google News section-based content the article belongs, not if people are particularly looking for an article of that nature. The news_keywords metatag will greatly increase your traffic and, most importantly to publishers, allows them to get creative with the title without being at risk of falling off on Google and Google News SEO optimization.

We just had an article on this, and I found this when checking SEO.

Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 8 months ago

Hi Peoples_Pundit, thanks for chipping in. So what’s your argument exactly? Would you say news keywords correspond mostly with WordPress categories or tags or both or do they deserve to be a dedicated taxonomy?
PPDPurveyor
(@peoples_pundit)

9 years, 8 months ago
With the function I wrote, I did set up the option for categories and tags to be used in the absence of news_keywords specifically entered in the text field, because they are closely related. For example, in the plugin’s functions.php file I have:
```
$bgnp_meta_kywrds = get_post_meta($post_id, '_bgnp_meta_kywrds', true);
	if( !empty( $bgnp_meta_kywrds ) ) {
		echo '<meta name="news_keywords" content="' . esc_attr( $bgnp_meta_kywrds ) . '" />' . "\n";
	}else{ .....
```
But for Google, they are used to help specifically identify what the post is about for the purpose of specific user search queries, versus where the post should be included topic-wise in Google News. That’s what the XML news tags are for. Google says:

One of the best ways to ensure that your site appears for particular user queries is to make sure that your article naturally contains the words, names, and figures that are central to a particular news story.

And on the <news:keywords> XML tag:

The tag is used to help classify the articles you submit to Google News by topic.

I am sorry for the last post, after reading it again, it wasn’t very clear, at all.
Plugin Author Rolf Allard van Hagen
(@ravanh)

9 years, 8 months ago

So would you say that the news_keywords meta tag (in the page <head> section) and the <news:keywords> tag (in the XML News sitemap) should correspond at all times or that they should be able to differ from each other sometimes?

Viewing 15 replies - 1 through 15 (of 15 total)

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