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WP Plugins vs Out Of The Box (13 posts)

  1. gspark
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    I'm all for a few plugins but here's a few issues I feel really impact the userfriendlyness of WP

    1. a few plugins ok but what are we suppose to do enable 10,0000 plugins to do what really should be built-into wordpress ? It's nonsense, come on, so many simple functions should not need a plugin, the developers of WP either lack common sense or really are not thinking about the big picture, many of the plugins i look for I feel should already be built in to WP, i think especially if people are using the same plugins for the same uses WP should really consider making it part of the core, seeing all the requests in the forums, i wonder does anyone at wp ever listen to the users ?

    2. many plugins are no longer being developed and/or are never compatible with the latest WP updates. The only WP version that ever really matters is the latest update, this only makes it more difficult for wp users, how much time is wasted trying to get plugins to work that really should no longer be on the plugin list, with the amount of time one spends on getting their site working like a real site should, they may as well have spent $500 to get a fully integrated CMS/Blog software to do the job. Compare time spent in getting all the features you want with shelling out a few hundred dollars which is really the value ?

    3. i understand that third party plugins are not WP's problem but seriously, nobody should create a plugin and not suport it for the latest WP, it's just common sense, many plugins should be combined into one and many plugins should simply be part of the WP core period.

    i know this sounds negative but I do believe WP rocks, it just hasn't really changed much since it was created a few tweaks and some eye candy but the core functions are lacking and just how many plugins will one have to find and enable to have a site worthy of cm standards, 20 plugins are too GD many he he

    It's all good though, WP is open source, this doesn't mean the functions have to be open source quality. I just hope WP evolves to something more capable without so many plugins,

    It would be cool to see a survey on the number of plugins people use, that would be interesting.

  2. Samuel Wood (Otto)
    Tech Ninja
    Posted 7 years ago #

    1. a few plugins ok but what are we suppose to do enable 10,0000 plugins to do what really should be built-into wordpress ? ... many of the plugins i look for I feel should already be built in to WP

    A lot of functionality in WordPress was indeed adapted from some of the better plugins available. And more is coming in the future. However, just because *you* think a plugin is very useful doesn't mean everybody will. The general viewpoint is that if it's not something most people will use, it doesn't go into the core.

    2. many plugins are no longer being developed and/or are never compatible with the latest WP updates.

    True, however, the fault of this is often either a) the plugin developer not writing for future usage or b) WordPress changing in some kind of really fundamental way. There's no way to be 100% backward compatible with all code. It can't be done.

  3. drmike
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    I stopped reading after "10,000 plugins" as you lost all credability with that statement. Please let me (and probably the rest of us) know when you feel like talking seriously instead of just complaining.

    By the way, it's open source. Instead of complaining about nonsense, (I remember you complaing about the filenames) how about doing something to solve the problem like opening up a trac ticket with the code or feature that you would like to see added in?

    Else you're just like my ex mother in law and that's not a good thing.

    edit: I have 106 plugins on my wpmu install for my end users. Different things for different folks. No two users are the same. Heck, only a third of them are using teh Google Sitemap plugin.

  4. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    wow Mike, I dont think that can be said any better.

  5. drmike
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Nah, didn't think much of my ex mother in law either. ;)

  6. gspark
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Hey now i was being kind :P and wasn't trying to dis WP i'm a WP fan, before i wrote this post, i read all 10,000 posts on the forums he he who's counting, but I do know for a fact that there are many plugins I personally have either come across or was looking for that really should be in the core and I also believe at least 99.9% of WP users would want in the core and expanded on, do a survey let people vote i mean really vote, just look at the extend area and support forums, so no I don't believe WP is listening to its users, not with both ears.

    All I know is WP is a few fries short of being a five star phenomenon and it's a shame what prevents it being so is silly features that people need and want but instead need 5-10 plugins to do the job. Like it or not, the future is not in blogging but in managing your content which means WP needs to step up the juice. I notice more people dropping WP for some other tool no doubt due to the lack of serious features required of a serious blogger or web contentsur.

    I hardly think I would not be writing this post if I wasn't dead on serious, some things really should be core functional, the ones that are common sense apply to everyone not just me. If it were just me i would haven't taken the time to write so just listen don't speak :))

    I'm only saying the things everyone else is thinking but are too afraid to say,

  7. OK, if you're actually serious, how about stating which plugins you think should be in the WP core? Not all 10,000 - just the 5-10 will do nicely.

    You'll more than likely find that not even close to 99.99% of WP users will agree. Some won't want any of them, some might agree with some of your selections, and others will want a different selection.

    By keeping the core (relatively) simple, WP allows users to extend or adapt it in the ways they want, rather than use it according to some vision of how it should work passed down from on high.

    You'll be treated a lot more seriously if you make specific comments rather than sweeping generalisations.

    And I haven't noticed people here being afraid to say anything much. It might just be that they don't share your ideas...

  8. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #


    All I know is WP is a few fries short of being a five star phenomenon

    What are you basing that on? What you think? C'mon.

    No-one begrudges your opinion..and hey guess what thats exactly what this:

    http://wordpress.org/extend/ideas/

    is for.

    It might surprise you to know that Matt does read and post to that area. So apparantly, he is "listening".

    And honestly, if you have such grandiose ideas about where WordPress need to go - by all means- go do it.

    1. Trac is wide open to anyone.
    2. There's plenty of dev mailing lists
    3. Better yet, take the source code, (try to )make it your own, pay for the hosting, and the bandwidth, and then you TOO can sit by while someone else takes wild potshots at something you've put together (sorta).

  9. petersig
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    I use 17 plugins, plus or minus 3, and just spent the afternoon deactivating and reactivating all of them to trouble shoot a problem.

    The real problem is that the plugins, and the hacks to the theme that I've done, prevent me from upgrading from WP2.04 to anything that does, for example, support widgets. I spend time downloading and checking out plugins that *say* they are compatible with 2.04 but that actually need widgets to function.

    That idea, of paying someone to do the work, looks attractive. Given the low current and expected return from this blog I'm working on, all it would do is give me more time for my day job--which I desperately need.

    I do pay for the hosting and the bandwidth, and have other blogs with later versions of WordPress (2.1.0 so far) that are easier to manage.

    What I would be willing to do (assist with) is developing a database of which versions and plugins work together. AND update the plugin listings accordingly. Also, a wayback machine for plugin versions that *did* work with earlier WP versions would be good. And yes, I'll send a copy to the wp.org/extend/ideas site.

  10. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    @petersig,

    the hacks to the theme that I've done, prevent me from upgrading from WP2.04 to anything that does, for example, support widgets.

    I disagree. While it is a matter of semantics, it's actually your insistence on using those plugins that prevents you from upgrading.

    That said, there are multiple ways to skin a horse.

    Additionally, I wouldn't be one to suggest an upgrade to 2.2.1. There are two branches to WordPress -- 2.2.x and 2.0.x

    The latest release in the 2.0.x branch is 2.0.11-RC3 and it is and has been available for some time:

    http://wordpress.org/download/release-archive/

    Upgrading to that version would NOT break any of your plugins.

    Additionally, as a fellow core hacker, I use and recommend grabbing a copy of Beyond Compare from http://www.scootersoftware.com/

    Its a great tool for diffing files in a windows environment.

  11. petersig
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Er, Thanks, but I'm definitely not a core hacker. I have gotten adventurous in hacking my theme, though.

    The information that I can upgrade to 2.0.11 RC3 (or 2.0.10, perhaps?) without breaking my plugins, and the link, is great.

    I think I can reverse hack my theme, if there are problems, by comparing a) the original theme files, with b) the hacked files, with c) the way the files show up (or don't) in 2.0.11.

    OK. Next time I am dodging work, or blog traffic is slow anyway, I'll upgrade in the 2.0 stream.

    Oh, and I know Beyond Compare well--and diffing, in my day job, editing digital files. It's a great program, I agree.

    It's not good for the environment, but for the hacking and fixing stuff I've already done, I've often printed out the original theme file, to compare to what's on the screen. Could do it with Beyond Compare, also, though. Generally WordPress problems have me feeling too stupid to use Beyond Compare.

    Again, thanks.

  12. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    use the 2.0.11 RC version.. there are some minor security issues addressed in that release that arent in 2.0.10. Its stable despite being an RC :) I wouldnt say that if I werent using it (somewhere). :)

    and your welcome :) as always!

  13. gspark
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    I believe one of the disfunctions of wordpress is that it believes so strongly that its only a personal blogging software, WTF is blogging software,

    think content management plain and simple, there's no such thing as blogging software not today, what are some of the things EVERBODY wants and needs, they are telling you on the support forums, are you listening ?

    i'm not talking about personal preferences such as "I would like a plugin latte that can display what i had for dinner last night" I'm thinking simple things like core user, groups, permissions, cms like functions, as i stated before WP is a few fries short, you add some of these basic features and everyone is going to love WP and drop their current cms software,

    Here's an idea WP should come with a set of very functionall plugins at least 7-8 out of the box instead of useless hello.php, these core plugins can be the official WP approved ones that most people would not need any other plugins for a fully functional cms web site. This could be the greatest idea since starbucks

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