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target=_blank on these forums = bad :) (48 posts)

  1. Michael Heilemann
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    Just thought I'd throw this in there: Under members, links to their sites will launch in a new window. I don't know about you, but I personally detest that :)

  2. codergurl
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    why? =P

  3. Michael Heilemann
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    For two reasons:
    I use a tab browser. That means that I have one window open (one entry on the taskbar). All sites that I currently have open are in tabs inside that window. That's the way I like to keep it. Ask mostly any tab-browser user, and they'll concur. Because of this I don't want new windows to open up cluttering my interface, taskbar and making my jump back and forth between windows.
    Secondly, it should be in the hands of the user to decide whether or not a link should open in a new window. You don't know what I'm doing or how I browse, trying to second-guess me just won't work. If I want to open a link in a new window I'll SHIFT-CLICK it.

  4. Geronimo
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    If you are using Mozilla or Firebird you can get tab extentions so all new windows open in a tab instead.

  5. codergurl
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    Eudaimic: I am a tab-browser user. =P
    Geronimo: That's what I do for both Firebird and MyIE. That why pages opening in new windows doesn't bother me. :)

  6. Michael Heilemann
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    What happens is that if I deem that I'm done with a site and I leave it through a link, I'll left click it. Which should load the link in the current tab so that I don't have to close it.
    But if target=_blank is used a new window opens instead... Great!
    Yes, it can be suppressed in Firebird, but that just opens a new tab instead, so we're back to square one.
    My point is that there is no point at all for anyone to use target=_blank. Period.

  7. Geronimo
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    It is just an extra click to me. heck you think this is bad you should of saw it when fark.com changed over to opening links in a new window.

  8. scooter
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    I use IE / mozilla, and i like to use _blank myself.

  9. Michael Heilemann
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    Why? You're taking away the choice from people, so I'm guessing you have a specific reason for it?
    If I want to open your link in a new window I choose to shift-leftclick it. Simple as that.

  10. Anonymous
    Unregistered
    Posted 10 years ago #

    I use target_blank all the time now in my links because I want to give people the choice of having my sites remain in the background. They have the choice of closing one or the other browser window down. If you look at the browser stats you'll see that most people are not using a tabbed browser, they're running some version of IE. See http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp Netscape, Mozilla and Opera simply aren't enough of a user base to be concerned about for an issue like this.

  11. Chris
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    "Netscape, Mozilla and Opera simply aren't enough of a user base to be concerned about for an issue like this."
    um everyone I know, uses mozilla and my stats come back 70/30 in favor of mozilla. I personally spoof mine (caugh) for people like you..

  12. Michael Heilemann
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    "Netscape, Mozilla and Opera simply aren't enough of a user base to be concerned about for an issue like this."
    Sorry, but WHAT?! Do you write your code using this principle as well? That's about the thinnest argument I've ever heard.
    "I use target_blank all the time now in my links because I want to give people the choice of having my sites remain in the background. They have the choice of closing one or the other browser window down."
    But don't you see, you not giving anyone a choice, you're taking it away from them! No matter what they do, links open in a new window. Instead why not give them the choice of deciding whether or not to do so?

  13. Anonymous
    Unregistered
    Posted 10 years ago #

    Sorry, meant to say I only use target=blank for external links. I have no control over what browser people use or their browsing habits. I doubt the average Web user is even aware of shift-left click. I know from my own long personal experience on the Web primarily with IE, but I also have used Netscape, Mozilla and Opera (and still do on occasion), that I'd rather, just as others of you would rather shift-left click to open a new window, have all new external links open in a new window. In some CMS applications this behavior can be set as a default for all links. In many, many sites I've visited over the years, this is also SOP. It's obvious that users who feel strongly about the "choice" issue won't be persuaded by any argument. Their minds are made up ... and so's mine.

  14. Anonymous
    Unregistered
    Posted 10 years ago #

    Should add too that the lateral solution to the target=blank issue is to change the browser, not the user, behavior. That's a challenge for you programmers: make it an option for the browser to interpret the various target options according to a user's preference. So target=blank could be interpreted by the browser as an option as open in a new window or open in the existing window. Isn't this easier and simpler than trying to impose "choice" on the user and taking design choices away from the site designer?

  15. Michael Heilemann
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    target=_blank isn't a design choice, it's a usability choice. And as such it's a bad one. But I guess you know of Jacob Nielsen, and so I'll let him do the arguing for me.

  16. OperaManiac
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    someone tell me which code to modify to make the link button in the admin panel generate a open in the new window code... no flames please.

  17. Anavy
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    Jacob Nielsen isn't my guru. Nothing is wrong with a new browser window, especially when you click on a link and get a non-existing page, or one that loads forever.
    However, I'm trying to avoid the "_blank" parameter for target. I'm mostly using an imaginary frame name like "nw" or a single letter for those links. So only one new window opens and is being reused by all links - unless it is closed.

  18. huphtur
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    "_target" is not allowed in XHTML 1.1
    So I dunno why its used here.

  19. Anonymous
    Unregistered
    Posted 10 years ago #

    They might be using only XHTML 1.0 Trans.

  20. huphtur
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    not on these wordpress support forums:
    <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.1//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11/DTD/xhtml11.dtd">

  21. Anonymous
    Unregistered
    Posted 10 years ago #

    target=_blank is not evil, jeez get over it. It's a good thing for outside links. *nods* I use it all the time. If it's a link outside of my site then the target=_blank is there. I want people to stay on my site. What is an extra click anyway?? *shakes head* People are weird. And well you can't please everyone.

  22. Anonymous
    Unregistered
    Posted 10 years ago #

    target="_blank" *IS* evil.
    "I want people to stay on my site. What is an extra click anyway?"
    If I go to an external site, *I'm* in charge of deciding if I want to come back to your website later on. You're making the assumption that I'd want to stay on your website? That's what wrong right there.
    As for the "extra click", Amazon patented "one-click" shopping, and there's lots of specs on how many clicks should be required from the home page to reach a piece of information (under 3 or 4, last time I checked).
    So when you're saying "what is an extra click anyway", I'll tell you : it's 25 to 33% too many clicks (I guess you'd be happy with numbers and statistics, so there you go).
    target="_blank" equals "you're just too damn stupid to know what the hell you're doing, so I might as well make the decision for you". That's a SURE way to get people NOT to return to your website, ever. Quite the opposite of your idea of making them STAY on your website.
    Website surfing is just that - surfing. You can't try to grab users and keep them on your website, unless you never link to any other website. And even then, you can't force them not to load anything else (or are you evil enough to use javascript to open a new window to your so-precious website once the user leaves/quits your website? That's about the same as target="_blank" anyway)
    enjoy your evil way.
    P.S.: Please give me the url for your website, so I can blacklist it. Thanks in advance.

  23. OperaManiac
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    add mine:
    http://www.sushubh.com
    http://blog.sushubh.com
    If I link a particular keyword in a para on a page to lets say its dictionary meaning, it does not mean a user reading that page would like to surf away from my page just coz he wanted to check the meaning of that word.
    I would rather let the user see a large version of thumbnail images in pop up window rahter than the same window.
    Most users are on IE. They dont have mouse gestures ;) Some things are better linked in a new window. No matter what you think...

  24. dgriff
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    I have to agree with those who like targer="_blank" for external links and large image popups. Maybe the coolest, leading edge users use Mozilla or Opera, but: 1) I don't. 2)Since I am uncool, it is no surprise that no one I know does. 3)Statistically most use some version of IE. 4) I hate it when I forget to shift/click and am sent awayto some nonexistent page, or to some forever loading hell. Besides, as a user, why should I have to use a bunch of extra keystrokes. 5) Most of my target audience is not user tabbed browsers. 6)Yes, I want them to stay on or return to, my site. OTOH, I do detest "_blank" within a site, other than for large image display. My 2cents.

  25. TechGnome
    Moderator
    Posted 10 years ago #

    WOW! My ears are burning... get a grip. There are far more evil things in this world to be arguing over something as petty as this. As a tabbed browser user too (Mozi), it usually takes me ONE click to learn that a site will target=_blank me.... no biggie, I close the new window, and Ctrl-Click it... new tab in my browser.... It's just not that importaint. Now, I wouldn't mind having a "Ignore target=_blank" option in my web browser.... but that's a decision for the browser developers to make. There are times when I do appreciate it.... If I go to a site where there is a list of resources I may want to visit, I WANT them to open a new window.
    If you don't like things opening in a new window, stop visting sites like that and don't click on anything. I hate having to stop for red lights, but I'm not going to ask them to cahnge is just because of the way ONE person is. If you want, take it up with the W3C.
    TG

  26. Anonymous
    Unregistered
    Posted 10 years ago #

    wow, chill boys.
    P.S. : just because someone shows up as using IE doesn't mean they don't have tabs. In fact, some of the IE-based browsers have much better tab support than Mozilla or Firebird.
    http://www.myie2.com
    http://www.avantbrowser.com
    http://www.netcaptor.com
    http://www.crazybrowser.com/
    http://www.toolpool.com/surface.php
    Heh, TUCOWS has a whole category of them: http://www.tucows.com/tabbed95_default.html

  27. Trinity22
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    Tabbed browsing isn't the only reason that Firebird or Mozilla is a better browser, fyi. Furthermore what is wrong with target="_blank". I certainly see no fault with it. I use firebird myself and if I want a link to appear in a new tab I middle click it, but I remember when I was using IE and hated to have to constantly hit the back button everytime I wanted to check something else out. Though about 70-75% of my visitors use Moz/Firebird I do it for the IE folks. But anyway, there's my opinion. And if the "_blank" get's you all angry and stuff.....chill out dude :P

  28. OperaManiac
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    It's the rendering engine of IE that pisses me. It remains the slowest browser to surf on on my connection. Opera is the fastest. Mozilla comes a distant second. My preference of using browser:
    Opera -> Firebird -> Mozilla -> MyIE2 -> IE

  29. webguynj
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    target="_blank" isn't bad, its just outmoded. The XHTML 1.1 spec fails your source if you use it unless you create your own DTD. So leave it. If people want to use it their site becomes at best 1.0 Transitional. HTML style is a personal choice like what browser you use and isn't that what blogging is all about anyway? Personal Choice!!!

  30. OperaManiac
    Member
    Posted 10 years ago #

    I prefer Opera for speed, features and convinience. tabs are just one of them...
    and have to make some hacks to make CSS work for IE users...
    and don't mind target as of now. :)

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