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WP-o-Matic
[closed] Thanks for the update (18 posts)

  1. oradev
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    I'm glad the project is back online. Thanks for your work. There's a company out there that has hijacked your project. They're called BusinessWebsiteDev dot com. They're charging around $25 for a plugin you built! What balls!

    http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/wp-o-matic/

  2. Ricardo Rauch
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    hahaha, amazing.

    I'm sure they are making money.

    Thanks for your words.

  3. CouponCodePlugin
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Thats me. We did not hijack the project, we are fully in line with the licensing. The person who added it to wordpress bought it from us and then stripped all the author details out which breaks the license.
    We have always complied with the license governing the coding, but they did not. We are asking them to add the author details back in so that it is in line with the license.

    Therefore, we are the company who brought it back to life as we updated it and fixed all the bugs with it. The person who added it to wordpress after illegally editing out author details is the one who has broken the license.

  4. CouponCodePlugin
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    And there you are rrauch. You are aware that we tracked you based on the details you used when you registered. This is how we know it is you.
    Can you now please add the correct author details back to the coding as per the license requirements?

  5. oradev
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Aha! Sorry to have inflamed matters. It seems a bit of a Robin Hood sort of thing has happened. Why isn't the plugin available for free from your firm?

  6. CouponCodePlugin
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Hello, we provided the plugin for free and planned to submit it to WordPress. However, we found that many customers preferred to pay for support and receive replies within 24 hours guaranteed. My team investigated the license and found that it allowed us to charge for the item. As such, we charged for it and provided premium support.

    rrauch purchased it from us using completely fake details, except for their email. They then stripped all author details from it, claiming it as their own which is against the license. They then removed the license, also against the license and finally, they edited a few lines (approx 4) and added a few more (approx 3).

    We know that it is this user who bought it from us as they used an email address from their own domain. This is where they then announced that they were providing it. I was happy to see that it was of use, but when I checked the coding I was not happy to see that they were illegally claiming it to be their own, had stripped it of all details of authors (we listed the original author as well as ourselves) and removed the license.

    If anyone is robin hood, it is us as we spent our own time and money to update it and initially provided it for free. I do not mean to be blowing my own trumpet, but we did this work so that people could enjoy it. We always stayed within the license to ensure it was completely compliant. Unfortunately rrauch has not done the same. When they commented on your post, they knew absolutely that they had obtained it from us and stripped it of all data.

    Why not check out our extensive support documentation as I am sure it will assist you in using the plugin: http://businesswebsitedev.com/support/wp-o-matic-installation-guide/

    We have already reported this plugin and offered to take over as what rrauch has done is against the whole ethos of GPL not to mention being against the license, rendering it null and void.

    Who would you trust? A company who has always been entirely up front, legal and within the license or a user who has been deceitful, untrustworthy and has breached the license?

    We do not want anything from the plugin, but the author (if you can call him that) must ensure he follows the license and complies fully with it.

  7. oradev
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Ok...so the picture becomes a bit clearer. But it seems that users who may not need support are being asked to pay for something they don't want. I'd wager that most people want only the plugin and are ok either hacking the code when they face an issue or relying on community support when the need arises.

    It doesn't stand to reason that users are being asked to pay for a once free plugin under the premise that they're paying for support and not the plugin itself, especially if your firm only changed/added a few lines of code to rrauch's original (and seemingly abandoned) FREE plugin.

    If the extensive support documentation you referenced above assists users with using the plugin, why the need to pay for premium support in order to actually get/download the plugin?

    Why not follow your initial path of offering the plugin for free and directing users who require support to your website? Other plugins exist that do this very thing, no?

    By the way, I'm bugged by the fact that rrauch left users in the loo for so long, too. But, I'm also confused how your firm has taken his code and now charges a fee for it.

    From my perspective, neither party is just; I hope it's all ironed out for the sake of WPO users.

  8. CouponCodePlugin
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Hello, as I pointed out, we always ensured that we acted within the restraints of the license. The customers that we had preferred to pay and receive guaranteed support replies within 24 hours.
    The license states that one can charge for support (warranties) and/or delivery. Thus, we could not charge for the plugin its self and to be honest we didnt want to. After all, we were charging $19.99 for lifetime premium support or just $9.99 if it was purchased with our other plugins.

    Why not follow your initial path of offering the plugin for free and directing users who require support to your website? Other plugins exist that do this very thing, no?

    Indeed, this is what we initially offered, but the problem was that customers did not want to pay for the support once they had the plugin. They would then open tickets or attempt to contact us using other means which took up a fair volume of time and money which we should have been spending on other customers. While I personally preferred this method, it resulted in unhappy customers and a series of attacks.
    Unfortunately, due to how most people act, it became very hard to provide support to them as they would make all manner of claims that we were somehow breaking the law when clearly we were doing nothing of the sort. This would result in them leaving slanderous claims on other sites which we then had to have removed as it had an unjust negative impact on our business. By changing up front for the support, it prevented this. This is just an unfortunate way that people act and react in given situations.
    For example, numerous people have threatened to sue us because we have a free lite plugin and a paid for premium plugin. A number of people thought this was illegal. We pointed out the licenses and showed them that it was not. So they simply stopped replying and went to another website where they could comment in which they fabricated fantastic lies about us, none of which were even remotely true. The time and money we spent having these removed should have been spent on our other customers. Thus charging up front for the support was the only way to prevent this and it was within the licensing agreement, so we proceeded with it. It worked well and we never experienced this type of incident again.

    You can look at almost any free plugin that provides paid support and you will see numerous users attacking them, making up lies and even resulting to name calling. This is what we entirely wanted to avoid. I have seen it happen so many times with other developers. Also, there are developers who charge separately for support, but they have abandoned support as well as abandoning the plugin, so you pay and get nothing in return. This may be what has caused the distrust within users resulting in the way they act towards companies charging for support.

    I do not mind at all if the plugin is on WordPress, in fact we had already prepared the files for it but had not submitted it.
    We added value to the plugin by addressing all the issues. Rrauch has not, all he has done is void the license and remove all author details, claiming himself as the author for all of the coding.

    We have already contacted WP about this issue and have asked permission for us to take over the project and provide support at the usual high levels that we provide. I really do not want to see the plugin get abandoned once more. In my personal opinion, I do not think that the current author can be trusted for reasons previously stated.

    I would love to be able to take this plugin and make it fly as high as it used to. Presently, its license is (as far as I can see) null and void. A quick comparison shows that they have added a total of 3 lines of code. We added (off the top of my head) hundreds of lines of code to address all the issues.

    Our aim when charging was to cover our costs in part and fund future development. I can tell you that we did not make a single cent of profit, we did not even come close to covering our costs. However that was never the issue, we wanted to provide a popular and quality plugin to the general public.

  9. CouponCodePlugin
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    You may not be aware of this (or maybe I read your reply incorrectly), but the user who uploaded wp-o-matic is not the one who wrote it initially. They seem to have gone forever.
    Rrauch purchased it from us using fake details (except email) and then stripped all the licensing and author details, adding a couple of lines and then uploaded it to Github. We tracked them after we saw they had used fake details. It was then removed from Github and uploaded to WP about 6 days ago.
    The stats on the plugin continued from the last time this plugin was on WP, but there is a gap of about 6 years in the development.
    If you check the sub, you will see that the user claims that they are updating it to work with v3.x which seems to be entirely untrue as it already worked with v3.x.

    I hope this helps to clear up the issue and I look forward to providing support to all the plugin users in future.

  10. Ricardo Rauch
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    @CouponCodePlugin

    I bought "your plugin" to see how you were taking profit from something FREE.

    I know you did an awesome work editing readme.txt and taking the name "wp-o-matic".

    If you see the code the difference between 1.0RC4 and 2.0 are 10 lines (4 are lines commented). I only added 6 lines. Most of them are fixes from forums like duplicate post bug. After 2.0 I did more progress, check it out.

    I think we can work together on this to give great support. Always for free.

  11. CouponCodePlugin
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Hello, I checked some of the files that you had uploaded, but not all of them.
    You incorrectly state that we were taking profit from something free. We did not and never intended to do so. We always acted within the license restraints even when we charged for it. You registered on our website using completely fake details which is considered to be fraud. While I fully understand that you would want to see what we had, that is not sufficient reason to provide fraudulent details. You know that we sent you an email explaining this and you ignored it, instead of communicating with us, you stripped all details from the plugin and uploaded it as if you were the sole author.
    I would have expected an honest person to have openly admitted that they obtained this copy from us, but you did not say that when you replied to the initial comment. However that is really not a big issue, it just adds to the other issues.
    If you look at all the other GPL items, you will see that they too use GPL items to create their items and they charge for them. This includes WooThemes, ElegantThemes, Press75, almost every other premium theme I have ever seen and almost every other plugin I have ever seen.

    As it stands, I see the following issues:
    1) License has been removed rendering the license null and void.
    2) Author details have been stripped and you added yourself as the sole author.
    3) You stripped the footer of all mention of the original author and us, replacing it entirely with your own details.

    I consider the above three items to be rather dis-trustworthy.
    You added the plugin to github (since removed) and mentioned it on twitter. Nowhere at all did I see you mentioning the previous authors and it looked as if you were the only author. You have seen our files as you edited them, so you will see that we DID NOT add ourselves as the only author, we paid homage to the original author. While this is not a strict license requirement, we believed that the people who put in effort to make this work really deserved the mentions.

    Please correct these issues above and we will happily provide support wherever possible.
    As a further item, I would request that you add a link to our support material as it covers every inch of the plugin which we had not seen done before.

    In the beginning, we provided "Free Plugin - Premium Support" where the plugin was free and the support was available as free (via wordpress forum) or premium (via our own system). These details can still be found on our website as we never fully changed over. This is how I was notified about this post as I was subscribed to receive updates. I would be happy to continue this, providing both free and premium support as I know some site owners need fast replies and in most cases this does not happen on wordpress forums.

    Many other companies take plugins and rename them to try to hide the original source and to prevent issues. We maintained the same name and same structure so that existing wp-o-matic users could upgrade to it without any issues at all.

    Here are the original posts we made about this plugin when we updated and released it:
    Free Plugins - Premium Support
    wp-o-matic released

  12. cqrt
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    I installed WP-o-Matic in June 2009 and I'm pretty sure rrauch's name was attached to it then. Am I missing something?

  13. Ricardo Rauch
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    He is another Rauch. I know him very closely.

  14. cqrt
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Quoting your original reply before you edited it..

    Copyright Guillermo Rauch 2008-2010
    Copyright Ricardo Rauch 2010-2012

    So you're Ricardo? And the original author is Guillermo?

  15. Ricardo Rauch
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    @cqrt Exactly.

  16. CouponCodePlugin
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Rrauch, where is the license file?
    Why have all other authors been removed from the plugin? I would have expected you to keep them within the plugin.

    I dont think you can claim copyright for the plugin as you do not own the copyright, you only own the copyright for the code you added.

    Do you have any intention to correct the following items?

    1) License has been removed rendering the license null and void.
    2) Author details have been stripped and you added yourself as the sole author.
    3) You stripped the footer of all mention of the original author and us, replacing it entirely with your own details.

    I am really not trying to be difficult, but it seems that you have taken this plugin and claimed it as your own as well as voiding the license.
    I believe these to be serious issues that should be corrected.

  17. Ricardo Rauch
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    This is my last message on this conversatiion. I don't understand how I'm discussing this with you if you didn't write a single line of code.

    Don't worry: I have explicit permission from the original author. He gave me all the rights.

  18. Oookay.

    There was one copyright removal by rrauch (in admin.js), and everything else was as it was for five years. AppleTalk was in his rights to hand the plugin over to anyone he wanted, and rrauch did what he should by crediting him.

    CouponCodePlugin, If you're claiming that AppleTalk stole your plugin over 5 years ago, that's a different matter, and I see you've been talking to Plugin Support about it, so further matters will be handled there.

    I'm closing this topic, and if either of you start this up again in the public forums, I'll put you on moderation, which means every single post of yours will have to be approved. Don't make me do that.

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