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Gurken Subscribe to Comments (deprecated)
[resolved] [Plugin: Gurken Subscribe to Comments] Warnings (39 posts)

  1. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    I keep getting a bunch of warning from PHP when I activate this plugin...

  2. infogurke
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 3 years ago #

    Do you really need this? Please don't visit this forum anymore.

  3. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hi there,

    I must say I had tried to contact you in the past in private to join forces on this plugin. I had made several attempts to get in touch with you, but it looks like you prefer to insult people and attach fellow developers instead of working together and delivering a better product to the community.

    I won't bother you anymore, don't worry.

    Thank you, pal.

    Camu

  4. infogurke
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hi,

    really? how?

    Everything I got was "hey use this plugin" or "don't use this old one, my plugin has n more features".

    I tell you what, I will install your plugin and compare my changes to the original plugin with your import approach. If it's working for my blog, it should work for others too. I don't care that much for this plugin, it can die when your plugin is a working replacement.

    Please don't expect a response in a few days ;-) and sorry for my comment in the other thread but from my point of view...

    Greetings
    Martin

  5. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hi there, I tried to contact you via email last October and November, I think. No answer. Then I thought you had just abandoned your plugin since your most recent replies have been posted months ago. And that is when I started "campaigning" for my version, which you must admit solves most of the issues highlighted by your users. I was just trying to give them a better service. I don't make any money out of it, actually I spend my spare time... And all I get is this blame? Well, thank you :)

    Feel free to test my plugin, I look forward to your feedback

    Camu

  6. infogurke
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 3 years ago #

    I tested your plugin. Every function I made to the original plugin seems to be present and working. The import process works, at least with my test blog.

    Is it true that you send the confirmation email every n days (n = cleanup days)? I chose a limit of one email per 24 hours:

    // check if author has subscribed to a comment in the last 3 months
    $sql = "SELECT COUNT(*)
    FROM " . $wpdb->comments . "
    WHERE DATE_SUB(CURDATE(), INTERVAL 3 MONTH) <= comment_date_gmt
    AND LCASE(comment_author_email) = '" . $email_sql . "'
    AND comment_subscribe = 'Y'";

    Your code is A LOT better than mark's subscribe to comments, but there are a few coding standards violations.

    Martin

  7. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Martin,

    thank you so much for spending some time combing through my code. I really appreciate it. As for your questions:

    1) clean-up refers to a cronjob that deletes "pending" subscriptions (the ones not confirmed when double opt-in is enabled) after X days. Right now there's no way to limit the number of requests per day, but I already have something similar in my todo list: users will be able to choose between a daily digest and instant emails

  8. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Sorry,

    I submitted an incomplete message by mistake. I forgot to ask you about those code standard violations. Could you please elaborate on that? I'd be more than happy to fix them. Also, contributions to improve the code are more than welcome. I'm currently working on my other plugin (wp slimstat) but I hope to be able to start working on my todo list for StCR soon

    Camu

  9. FolioVision
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hello Martin,

    we had some issues with your plugin, so we switched to Subscribe to
    Comments Reloaded. We are having even more issues with that - the
    import of your subscription status from wp_comments table is also
    importing subscribed email for spam comments. So then it's sending out
    notification to these spammers. Terrible!

    We are willing to fix your plugin and send you the fixes. That will
    allow us to go on using your plugin on new sites. Some people
    complained about the WP 3.1 compatibility, so we will see if we have
    any issues. We noticed some interface problems, so I'm talking mainly
    about that.

    Let us know if you are willing to review these changes and put them
    into plugin and perhaps leave a link of "thank you" somewhere on the
    plugin page.

    Thanks,
    Martin Vicenik

  10. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hi Martin Vicenik,

    what my plugin is importing is all the subscriptions recorded by Gurken's and Mark's plugins, so if these are spam-related, and it's sending notifications to them, same thing would have happened with Gurken's version. Unless I'm totally missing the point of your support request.

    Anyway, if there's anything I can do to improve my "reloaded" version of Mark's plugin, just let me know.

    Camu

  11. FolioVision
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Camu,

    That's simply not true.

    Mark and Gurken's version do not send out to spam and trashed addresses. Yours does.

    Plus you are creating a completely unnecessary extra table for subscriptions which are better managed together with the comments in the main WordPress comment table (which both Mark's and Gurken's versions do).

    Your plugin is very dangerous and could easily get a site owner or a server blacklisted as a spammer. We found Subscribe to Comments to include extremely careless programming of critical functionality.

    Unfortunately, as you pointed out Martin Gurken is a turtle. We want to pass him important changes to improve functionality of the Gurken Subscribe to Comments and we haven't heard a word. Not via email not via WordPress.org.

    Making the web work for you, Alec

  12. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Foliovision,

    I get a feeling of anger in your words, I don't see why. We should work all together to improve WordPress and to offer a better service to the community, not try to protect our own backyards and personal interests. Please, allow me to answer to your message one thing at a time:

    In my opinion, the table is not unnecessary from a DB design point-of-view. Using wp_comments creates data duplication: multiple comments will hold the information about each single subscription, if I post multiple comments to a given article. The "status" value could be altered for one of those comments but not for the other, thus creating inconsistencies. Scenario: I post a comment to your article and subscribe. A few days later I post another comment. Then, a few days later I decide I want to unsubscribe from that post. In your way of implementing this, you will have to update ALL the entries in wp_comments related to that subscription, in my way there's only one entry. I just see this a better way to create a model of how things work in reality: one subscription = one entry in the database.

    Also, in my opinion it's never a good idea to modify a "system" table, because WordPress is not aware of the change and that could cause problems. There are other reasons why I decided to use a separate table (query optimization among the others), though.

    Having said this, I am starting to think about using wp_commentmeta instead of a separate table, WITHOUT changing its structure, but leveraging it, to carry the extra information that keeps track of the status of a subscription. Avoiding redundancy and data duplication, and achieving optimal performance are my first and most important goals.

    Also, my plugin has been voted more than 100 times with almost always 5 stars, and it's been around only a few months, so I guess that means it's not such a sh*tty piece of software as you are implying in your message, don't you think?

    My plugin is not 'very dangerous' if you know what you are doing: install Akismet or any other spam prevention software, and you will be perfectly fine. It's like you're blaming your doctor for giving you a medicine you don't take. It's YOUR responsibility, not the plugin's developer, to use the right tools to avoid potentially "dangerous" situations.

    Also, I'd like to ask you to elaborate on your sentence "We found Subscribe to Comments to include extremely careless programming of critical functionality." That would help me understand what I did wrong.

    Love and peace, brother!
    Camu

  13. FolioVision
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Camu,

    We had Akismet installed.

    Your software got one of our mail servers banned from several prominent ISP.

    Outbound mail is not something to treat as casually as you do.

    So yes, I'm not very happy with you and your big empty promises. We were even less happy when we went in and looked at your code and found that you were creating all kinds of unnecessary additional tables.

    And even less happy when your "compatibility" with Mark Jacquith's Subscribe to Comments and Gurken's Subscribe to Comments turned out to be one way. Getting out of the pickle of installing your buggy Subscribe to Comments Reloaded on several sites was an afternoon of work.

    Thanks a lot for misrepresentation, empty promises and a totally casual attitude towards damaging your users sites and reputation.

    Your attacks on Gurken are totally unmerited as at least his software doesn't damage users' sites and reputation. Gurken didn't deserve the kicks in the teeth you gave him. Alas, you richly merit yours.

    Making the web work for you, Alec Kinnear
    Creative Director
    http://foliovision.com

  14. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Kick in the teeth? Misrepresentation? Stop drinking too much Vodka, Mister "Creative Director" :) And feel free to use whatever you like, I'm not pointing a gun to your head to force you to use my plugin.

    I hope your customers will see how their Creative Director behaves in public forums, and get the right idea about how you conduct your business, man!

    Peace and love, brother!
    Camu

    PS: even InfoGurke said "Your code is A LOT better than mark's subscribe to comments" here above :) Just so you know...

  15. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Just for the sake of comparison, this is what the other plugins do when they have to decide if it's time to send the notification:

    if ( $comment->comment_approved == '1' && $comment->comment_type == '' )

    and this is what my plugin does

    if (empty($info) || $info->comment_approved == 'spam') return $_comment_ID;
    if (!empty($info) && $info->comment_approved == '1')
    ...

    So how Mark & Gurken's plugin would be different from mine? Could you please elaborate on that? From what I can see they behave exactly the same way, so if mine sends spam, so do them. Unless you can prove me I'm wrong. With facts and code, not just "nasty words".

    Camu

  16. infogurke
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hello Martin Vicenik,

    your email is marked as unread in my inbox and this thread is
    also marked unread in my google reader account. I planned an answer
    and a patch for camu this weekend (easter).

    You may have noticed the following while reading this thread: I am planning to discontinue my fork. Camu's plugin makes it much better. And I do like the separate table. If I write a new plugin I will definitely choose an own table. I don't like the approach that a plugin alters wordpress's tables.

    Subscribe to comments is very old and really ugly but the
    functionality is similar to camu's plugin. Why should your patch not
    work for his plugin?

    If this is so urgent for you, why didn't you mail me the patch in the first place?

    Greetings
    Martin

    BTW: Gurken is the german word for cucumber, my "logo" http://www.infogurke.de/.

  17. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Martin,

    your patch will be more than welcome, my friend :) I'd love to have you on board for this project. I'm currently working on my other plugin, WP SlimStat, so I haven't had time to release new updates for this one. Even if I already started working on bug fixes and new features.

    Happy Easter!
    Camu

    PS: camu stands for "camuriusu" which is a word in Sicilian dialect that means "an annoying person" :D

  18. infogurke
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hi annoying person ;-)

    i looked over the sources and created a patch:

    http://spuetz.net/stcr-coding-standards-trunk.patch

    I assumed your coding standards, I hope I got them right.

    There are a few white-spaces at the end of some lines, i removed all of them. Maybe you can use the "remove trailing spaces" of your editor, i.e. shortcut in netbeans or AnyEdit plugin for eclipse based ides.

    Greetings
    Martin

  19. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hi Cucumber :-P

    Thank you so much for sharing your coding standards. I must admit the code is not squeaky clean yet, I've been focusing more on functionality and optimization and less on readability and such. I will apply your patches as soon as I restart working on my plugin.

    Best,
    Camu

  20. infogurke
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 3 years ago #

    hi,

    I saw the thing with readability, especially the usage of the ternary operator ;-)

    I'm using zend framework's coding standards:

    http://framework.zend.com/manual/en/coding-standard.coding-style.html

    with 2 modifications:

    - class {
    - Variable Substitution $var = "foobar " . $i . "\n";

    Greetings
    Martin

  21. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Yes, I've never liked the bracket on a new line. I know it could "impact" readability, but indentation is there for a reason, after all :)

    Your feedback is really appreciated, indeed. I was using a leaner version of those coding standards, but you make a good point, so I'll definitely work on that.

    Camu.

  22. FolioVision
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Camu,

    Your plugin does send out emails to spam addresses. Mark Jacquith's and Gurken's don't.

    People, use the Subscribe to Comments Reloaded plugin at your own risk. Gurken's is far more reliable for the moment.

    Alec Kinnear
    Creative Director
    Foliovision

  23. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Dear "Creative Director",

    you can say whatever you want, too bad you cannot SUPPORT with FACTS your empty statements and false claims. I just demonstrated that the two plugins work EXACTLY the same way. But again, I'm not forcing anyone to use the plugin I developed DONATING my FREE time to the community. Not like you that make money using things that OTHER PEOPLE have developed for free. Thank you for your nice and friendly contribution! Go back to Austria and stop bragging around!

    Camu

  24. FolioVision
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Hi Camu,

    You'd do better to learn to program and test safe compatible plugins before going on a promotion round.

    You promise non-existent compatibility with Gurken's Subscribe to Comments and Mark Jacquith's Subscribe to Comments (which are cross-compatible). That's false advertising and very misleading.

    On top of that with your plugin, there's a real danger of sending out hundreds of emails to dead spam addresses and getting one's mail server banned.

    As I said, you'd do better to go back to learning to program safely first and stop hyping what is a ticking time bomb. If you don't like other WordPress users to have fair warning, take more care in your programming next time.

    Your unfriendly posts knocking Gurken's plugin set the tone of this discussion. Just one example at the top of this thread:

    I had made several attempts to get in touch with you, but it looks like you prefer to insult people and attack fellow developers instead of working together and delivering a better product to the community.

    Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind.

    Making the web work for you,

    Alec Kinnear
    Creative Director
    Foliovision.com

  25. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Okay, thank you. Now can we move on and live our own lives in peace?

    Camu

    PS: I will not reply to your messages anymore, Mister "Creative Director". If you suck at managing your servers, it's not my problem.

  26. FolioVision
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    This just in via email from camu.

    I know it's you.

    You are registering fake accounts to lower the score of my plugin, I know it! You are such a loser, my friend. I really hope you go out of business.

    Are you out of your mind, camu?

    We have neither the time nor the inclination for such juvenile pranks.
    _____________________

    If you are thinking of using Subscribe to Comments Reloaded, think carefully.

    1. untested code put into general release which can result in sending out hundreds of spam from your mail server
    2. false compatibility claims
    3. unpleasant attacks on authors of yeoman plugins in the genre (Mark Jacquith and Gurken)
    4. even wilder accusations against anybody who does not like his plugin

    Is this the kind of plugin author whose plugin you really want running on your site?

    Caveat emptor.
    ______________________

    We're considering doing an upgrade of Gurken as Martin seems inclined to abandon Gurken unfortunately. Our upgrade will be fully cross-compatible with original Gurken and Mark Jacquith's original Subscribe to Comments so you will be able to switch between the plugins as you wish.

    Our focus will be on safety, compatibility and simplicity.

    Anyone interested in such an upgrade to Gurken, feel free to let us know. If there's a lot of interest, we'll accelerate development.

    Making the web work for you,

    Alec Kinnear
    Creative Director
    Foliovision.com

  27. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    I'm just replying to ask you if you think I should abandon the development of my plugin. If so, just say YES and I will post an announcement on the plugin's page. Then we'll see what the community that is using it will say. Ok?

    Regards,
    Camu

  28. FolioVision
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    No, what I was originally suggesting is that anyone who is running commercial sites should continue to run Gurken Subscribe to Comments or Mark Jacquith's original Subscribe to Comments as your plugin is not adequately tested and can jeopardise one's mailing reputation by sending out update notifications to spam addresses.

    Now that I've seen you in action with:

    1. what appear to be multiple sock puppets: dieglo, Beatrice54 and carmela79
    2. wild accusations of vote rigging
    3. mean spirited propaganda campaigns against existing plugins (Gurken)
    4. nasty attacks on plugin users: "I really hope you go out of business."

    I would recommend that anyone who values his or her website stay well clear of your code and deal with a more responsible and less erratic developer.

    Alec Kinnear
    Creative Director
    Foliovision.com

  29. infogurke
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 3 years ago #

    Alex, please!

    Subscribe to comments Reloaded has a good code quality (I went through every line and fixed a few coding-standards related issues). It's well-maintained and used by many people, so you can assume that StcR is tested!

    Subscribe to comments and my fork is old and a piece of crap. Look at the code that determinates whether the databases needs an update.

    Alex, please provide further details on the "spam sending" topic and don't post anymore unconfirmed "we got blocked because your plugin is trash" stuff.

    I don't think camu spirited a campaign against my fork!

    btw: At work we use dedicated mailservers to send emails from our webservers to prevent blacklisting / lower the effects. We're using qmail's qmqp protocol it's a lot faster than smtp and reduces the execution time.

  30. camu
    Member
    Posted 3 years ago #

    Martin,

    Thank you for your kind words. I must admit I was feeling a little discouraged by Alex' words. I've always tried to be responsible and to support my plugin as much as I can. But not at this price! My spare time, that I DONATE for free to the community, can be spent on other stuff, if people think my work is crap ;)

    Best,
    Camu

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