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Brand new user, client wants different comps (20 posts)

  1. webbetty
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Hello,

    I have a web client who is moving all of his podcasts to WordPress, which is great, except he had someone else do the initial design. Now he wants me to take over and re-design.

    Is there a way to provide him with a variety of "comps"? I'd like to use three different templates, making small changes to each, for him to review and choose one. Do I have to have each one on its own server/host?

    I'm a newbie to blogs so any insight is greatly appreciated!

  2. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Please earn your money by acquainting yourself with the application you are going to be working with.

    http://codex.wordpress.org/Main_Page

  3. webbetty
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Wow, I've been reading through a lot of discussions and I have to say this is the most over-bearing bunch of users I've come across.

    Since you've decided to comment before you know any of the situation, I'll elaborate. This client paid me $150 for a full-blown website two years ago (the price was so low since he was a friend of a friend). That site blew up into two sites over the course of two years. Then he stumbled across WordPress in Dec. and decided it was the answer to his prayers. At the time, he DIDN'T WANT TO PAY ME to basically RECREATE his site using WordPress so he found someone else who was supposed to be an expert. This person definitely knows what they are doing, however, the design was not what the client wanted.

    Now he has come back to me and has offered another $150 to do all of the work. Did I mention there are 75+ podcasts that have to be entered? Or that there will be three separate blogs total?

    I've been using WordPress for 6 months now to understand the basics and I spent 4 hours last night reading about plugins, PodPress, and the backend of the blog. So, I think I have definitely earned the meager $150 I'm being paid for this project.

    If you don't have any better assistance to offer, it is appreciated if you keep your sarcastic comments to yourself.

  4. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Look, your specific financial issues with a job has no bearing on my reply.. not the previous one, and not the one I'm going to offer now.

    I also wasnt being sarcastic, but now that you decided to open that door, I'll happily walk through it.

    You feel like you misquoted a job.. obviously. And.. ? What? Dare I suggest that maybe if you knew MORE about wordpress you might not have????

    And that means that someone else ought to feel warm and cozy about giving you free help for something you are getting paid for???

    I disagree.

    You are being paid -- like it or not. Well compensated or not.

    The people here dont get paid.

    And frankly, I, personally, have always found it insulting when paid "designers" come here and ask for free support. How incredibly opportunistic to come and attempt to gleam information off unpaid volunteers when you are being paid to DO that legwork. Thats quite a racket if you ask me..

    Especially when some of the people that offer their support here do the same kind of work, only they can do it better.

    I provided the link to your legwork already --

  5. webbetty
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    If you don't like giving "free help" why do you even read through the support forums? I don't understand your hostility towards me, nor do I understand why you have found it necessary to attack me and my request. I have read through much of the content on the link you sent. I did so BEFORE I posted my simple question. I did not see an answer and thought a support forum was just that: SUPPORT. I asked ONE question and for that you have decided that berating me instead of providing an answer is warranted.

    It's funny, I went to your blog and I see all of these "Things to Believe In" that list very worthwhile and charitable organizations, yet you yourself do not choose to be charitable. Instead your are "offended" that someone dare to ask a question in a SUPPORT FORUM, when they were unable to find the answer they were looking for while doing their own research.

    You certainly attained your goal of making me feel like a second-rate designer/developer. I guess you never started from scratch on any projects, you've always been paid what you are worth, and you've always been an expert at anything new you have tried. And I bet you've never asked a question on a support forum--you're that good.

  6. webbetty
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    BTW, I never said I misquoted. I offered a very low price to a friend of a friend, to be charitable.

  7. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    And I bet you've never asked a question on a support forum--you're that good.

    Ive asked plenty of questions on these support forums, not for jobs I was paid for though.

    Your defensivness is much more evident that my supposed hostilty.
    Ive now twice! directed you to where the answer to your question is .. did you need someone to point out the exact page/link for you??

    Im sure in the time youve spent looking at my site, and replying here you could have found it by now.

    For the record, charity is not helping someone that is getting paid to do the work they are essentially asking you to do.

    Your answer is inside the codex -- I provided you a link to it. The rest is up to you.

    I give free help to people that aren't trying to make a buck off MY knowledge.. Thats the difference -- its not a slant against you personally, its against all those "designers" that take on WP jobs and them come here asking for information about how to do this, that, etc..

    Thats not called charity -- thats called a con.

  8. webbetty
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    So your problem with me is that I've asked ONE question for a job I'm taking money for. I have not asked anyone to design the job for me. I have not asked anyone to do any work for me, where I can take the credit. I simply wanted to know if there was an easy way to provide working comps to a client. That's it.

    I wasn't asking for anyone's personal diatribe on what's charity and what's not. I simply had one question that I have not found an easy answer to. I am defensive since you implied that the work I do is shoddy and that I'm out to con people. I guess I don't understand how the WordPress support forums are supposed to work and I will discontinue using them.

    I have found my solution, no thanks to any help here. I hope your day is better now that you have put me in my place. Thank you for the link.

  9. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    I am defensive since you implied that the work I do is shoddy ...

    Jesus, where do you come up with that? I said this:

    Especially when some of the people that offer their support here do the same kind of work, only they can do it better.

    Thats not based on what you can do -- I dont even know what YOU can do. I didnt even look at your profile link. I'm basing what I said off an individuals experience with WordPress. nothing else, nothing more.

    Do you do shoddy work? I have no clue as to whether or not you do.

    Arguably, someone like Root (http://more404.com/) who can design but also knows and understands how WP works, is going to be vastly better at implementing a WordPress driven site than someone who doesn't know the underpinnings of this application.

    Thats kind of a given.

    Anyway, happy you finally found what you were looking for inside the codex, that amazingly wonderful pool of knowledge.

  10. Root
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Crikey. :). Blatant unsolicited flattery aside - I think a lot of helpers here - many of whom do a lot of paid work - blanch at helping out other folk on commercial work. Its kind of dog eat dog. I am sure a lot of folk do not mention they are getting paid. But that is life. It sucks. There has just been one of these in the com forum. It got a similar response both ways. :)

  11. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    "cheeky comes to mind" :)

    as for flattery -- you deserve it.

    Fwiw, I do VERY little paid work. Ive never been paid to design a wordpress blog, and frankly am not sure if I would want to. Im way too anal and prolly far too slow for most people's "timelines" It's hard enough for me to be happy with my own site -- much less someone else's.

  12. webbetty
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    You also said this "Especially when some of the people that offer their support here do the same kind of work, only they can do it better." which I took as an insult. No, I do not do shoddy work.

    I am not looking to take anyone's theme and pass it off as my own. Yes, I am being paid. My client does not have the time to do this himself or he would. I am simply taking his podcasts and putting them in a blog. I will be using someone else's design (do you think, as a designer, this makes me happy?) and will in no way be taking credit for it.

    There's no need to worry about my soliciting help again. I've been "acquainting myself" with WP as was so politely recommended at the beginning of this discussion. All of this so I can assist one particular client.

    I like your site Root.

  13. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    You also said this "Especially when some of the people that offer their support here do the same kind of work, only they can do it better." which I took as an insult. No, I do not do shoddy work.

    do you read? You just reposted exactly what I already said, I said .. get over it already and just go read the fricken codex.

    thank you Moshu, after the fact.

  14. moshu
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Lets close this fruitless discussion with the agreement that
    1. You, webbetty, don't do shoddy work.
    2. whooami doesn't like and want to offer free help to those that do paid work for their clients.
    (Neither do I...)
    3. Root knows a lot about CSS and WP :)
    4. I will delete everything after this post and, eventually, close the topic if further posts appear.

    Thank you.

  15. syncbox
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Hello, webbetty...

    I think that what some were saying is that had you read even the littlest bit of the documentation pertaining to how themes work, you would know that you don't need separate servers...

    Just set up separate folders for each theme, modify the style.css comment at the beginning of the file to name your themes, change the css layouts to suit, then upload them to the /wp-content/themes/ directory.

    If they are accurately coded, the user can switch themes and see their data/content displayed in your "comps".

    Personally though, comps to me mean graphic design - showing the same content in a graphic image for client review... I would not go as far as to develop 3 different themes at all - just show ideas graphically and get client feedback and a sign off on a design. Then code.

    I do a LOT of paid design (graphic and code) using WP. I do ask questions here, just as I take advantage of all the cool plugins out there that have been developed. My first site had a zillion category pages. My latest only uses one main file (with header, footer and sidebar) and php programming to control what displays... you definitely learn through doing and asking questions here...

    However, I try to read the documentation first, use google searches of the docs and forums second, then post and beg politely. I've had times where I am frustrated and have vented about a new "feature"... (just 'fessing up here)

    What I DO know is... venting and being insulting about those who try to steer you to the docs or suggest you try to learn even a little about what you have taken a paid job for is only going to ensure that no one answers future questions.

    hth

  16. whooami
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    syncbox,

    winderful reply ... even if you refered to me as "some" :)

    I don't mean to dote on root, as it were, but he really said it so eloquently in another completely unrelated thread ...and unfortunately I cannot find that thread right now.

    Im not always diplomatic and I know that -- I admitedlly expect people to live up to some high standards -- but my intentions are good,

    I do, however, bristle at threads that begin with "..a client .. wants this .."

    Root made a point somewhere about the difference between 'normal' designers and WP designers, that eally made sense to me -- I, for the life of me cant find it now, and he is so much more diplomatic than I am anyway -- but the gist of it was that you need to know more than how to manipulate a .psd to build for WP -- you NEED to code.

    Even you alluded to that. :)

    And thats where I get defensive -- you can,I am sure, speak to the hours you have spent on 'that'

    PS: omg, I really need to go lay down, I am toast. literally.

  17. syncbox
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    I understand your POV, I do... sometimes my jaw drops when I read posts (not just here, but on other forums, like those for Adobe's Dreamweaver software, for example) that seem downright demanding of help (as if a forum was customer support for WP) and petulant when someone suggests that perhaps understanding the software you are using is step 1 of being able to use it!

  18. Root
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    To answer the question. Comps are much beloved by graphics designers and are commonly produced as .psd. Coders on the other hand might knock up a simple site in php/html and use a style switcher for the various color palettes. They would prolly set up the colors in the markup in classes so they could quickly knock out say - a dozen schemes. Nothing fancy.

  19. syncbox
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    Except that it isn't just about colors of text or even containing blocks... there is the layout and the logic of the site.

    That's probably the most important reason why someone who takes a paid job to design a wp site needs to understand the markup, css and php end of things. If the designer doesn't understand where to "put" the content (using php logic to conditionally show things, likely) then they find themselves frustrated by how wp will remove injected scripting or markup or whatever.

    I do things either way - I take other designers' ideas and translate to a working site AND/OR design the look/logic and translate that to a working site. I prefer the later only because many graphic site designers don't understand how dynamic sites work and think it's all about the pixels...

    rather than logic, user interface, simplicity, SEO, the content from the visitor's perspective, etc

    Anyway, it's an interesting topic. Getting back to the request for help, it's all about trying to balance polite requests with helping yourself with the existing documentation and previous help supplied in this forum...

    IMO.

    Casey

  20. Root
    Member
    Posted 7 years ago #

    It is very easy to argue that the color is the leastimportant thing. The designer has allowed the client to dictate what is what. He might get what he thinks he wants. He may not get what a pro at the proper rates would do. Eg What is the browser specification? The accessibility statement / 508? SEO profile? etc.

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