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W3 Total Cache
Bigger & Slower (40 posts)

  1. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    I'm very confused with this plugin after at least 20+ hours of trying to figure it out & having signed up to Amazon S3 ... very frustrating. Maybe I don't know what i am doing but i think i've followed the installation instructions and loads of online tutorials.

    According to Pingdom.com - if I use minify "auto" mode the CSS breaks but my site seems really fast and the fewest requests and the size is reduced quite a bit but not drastically (I'm guessing the js won't work either).
    If I use minify "manual" mode the css works, but the site gets bigger (1.5MB > 2.2MB) and the request increase (43 > 53).

    ..... just when i thought i am getting somewhere!!!

    Any ideas or suggestions?
    site: http://www.anthonypeyper.com (excuse the mess right now)

    Any help will REALLY be APPRECIATED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

    http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/w3-total-cache/

  2. davemhui
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    If all you want to do is load site faster, the greatest improvement you can get by using a CDN - content delivery network.

  3. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Hi Dave,
    Thanks for the suggestion - this is actually part of my problem. I am using Amazon S3 for CDN, but doesn't seem to work as I expected. Still seems to take quite long to load.
    My site seems to perform better without W3 Total Cache!
    (I'm feeling really stupid here)
    A.

  4. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Some suggestions:

    - Do not use Amazon S3 but Amazon Cloudfront instead. S3 is not a real CDN, but only a "bucket".

    - Use cache preloading. The official version of "3c total cache has some faults in cache preloading, use this version instead. I use it and it works brilliantly.

    - switch minify to manual and use the "help" wizzard to exclude those .js or .css files which "break" your site. Simply leave those files out.

    - if you are on shared hosting, do not use database caching, sometimes object caching causes problems.

  5. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Thanks wp-fan! Does this mean I have to cancel everything with S3? And ONLY use Cloudfront? I don't need both do I? A lot of research showed people using S3...
    I'll do some more research.
    thanks again!

  6. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Managed to figure out the Cloudfront thing - think it's working cos all my image links are now Cloudfront links.

    Still struggling with the minify thing though.... Deleted all the css files in the help mode and still the pages break in Minify Manual Mode!

    :/

  7. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Poo! I thought I had the CDN thing sorted and checked via YSLOW and get the following ratings:

    ---------------
    Grade F on Use a Content Delivery Network (CDN)
    There are 13 static components that are not on CDN.
    You can specify CDN hostnames in your preferences. See YSlow FAQ for details.
    http://www.anthonypeyper.com: 9 components, 523.4K (63.7K GZip)
    connect.facebook.net: 1 component, 178.3K (58.9K GZip)
    prophoto.s3.amazonaws.com: 3 components, 47.0K

    Grade F on Add Expires headers
    There are 5 static components without a far-future expiration date.
    (2013/2/1) http://connect.facebook.net/en_US/all.js
    (2012/12/20) http://prophoto.s3.amazonaws.com/img/ajaxLoadingSpinner.gif
    (no expires) http://d3ypcvrw8p9k6.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/p4/images/about-me.jpg
    (no expires) http://prophoto.s3.amazonaws.com/img/facebook_sketched_128.png
    (no expires) http://prophoto.s3.amazonaws.com/img/twitter_sketched_128.png
    --------------------------------

    I feel so lost I'm not even sure I was playing the game in the first place!!!

  8. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @acp73:

    Thanks wp-fan! Does this mean I have to cancel everything with S3?

    Yes. Delete the S3 bucket and use the cloud front upload option in total cache.

    Grade F on Add Expires headers

    Please use the expiry settings of the screenshots shown in the post that I have linked above. And and recommend to use the w3 total cache version that I have linked above!

    You can specify CDN hostnames in your preferences

    I have checked your site with tools.pingdom.com . In the "waterfall" tab, I can see some of your pictures are still not being served by cloudfront.

    I recommend using 10 CDN hostnames (for example, cdn1, cdn2, cdn3 ...). In the beginning, I have only used one, and with 10, more elements should be picked up and served by cloudfront.

    In your sourcecode, I can see you have not registered the cloudfront CNAMES with your hosting company. While this does not make any difference in speed to my knowledge, it just does not look nice and may not be beneficial to your SEO. Please check this description how to change this.

    Deleted all the css files in the help mode and still the pages break in Minify Manual Mode!

    Maybe the problem is with one of the .js files? Try to delete suspicious .js files from minify setup. When you find the culprit, re-add all other .js and .css files, but leave out the .css file which is related to the faulty .js file.

    And one more time: Use the w3c total cache version that I have linked in my post above. Definately switch on preload cache with the settings in the screenshot that is part of the post I have linked to. This will make your site a _lot_ faster, too.

    Let us know how you are proceeding!

    PS: Great photos, by the way.

    PPS: Picture missing here. Pitty...

  9. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @wp-fan,

    Thank you so much! I am going to try figure out all you are saying. I'm just a bit confused about the S3/Cloudfront setup. It just seem like Cloudfrotn needs S3.... though i probably hav it totally wrong!

    I'll let you know how it goes!

    Thnaks again!!

  10. sitespeed
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    One thing that you must really check is by deactivating all these plugins , deleting them and then checking the site load time. It may so happen that these plugins take up some space and increase the number of requests in some rare cases.
    Although do keep a backup of blog before deleting the plugins , and also after you have deleted them
    This is just to check how much improvement you get by using plugins.
    All I mean to say is that you may end up using all these plugins without much effect to site load time.
    Also save your settings for plugins like w3 etc so that when you install them again, you don't have to rework the whole settings.

  11. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    My pleasure, acp73.

    It just seem like Cloudfrotn needs S3

    No, it does not. in AWS console, you can give your Cloudfront instance a freely chosen name, no need to distribute a S3 bucket. Cloudfront will search and store the files by itself, no need to store them in a S3 bucket. I know many people get this wrong, but believe me, I have the same setup and it works very well.

    To summarize things: From my experience the biggest impact has

    - precache loading (the original version 0.9.2.5 from the official plugin repository has a fault, use the one that I have linked above instead!)
    - using a CDN
    - _manual_ minifying (and leaving out the .css and .js files that won't work with minify)
    - using all browser cache options

    Kind regards,

    Thomas

  12. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @Thomas

    You've been really helpful. I think I am getting the hang of it slowly but surely. Seems there are 3 options with using a CDN
    1. Simple Bucket - S3
    2. Push content - Cloudfront + S3 bucket
    3. Pull content - Cloudfront with domain origin (as opposed to S3 bucket origin)

    I've managed to get the pull content working (thanks to your help) but as soon as II create and a 2nd distribution such as: absgdfetrhwh.cloudfront.net - Get the following error message:
    Domain name absgdfetrhwh.cloudfront.net is not in distribution CNAME list.

    Maybe you meant something else by using 10 CDN hostnames. Is each hostname a new Distribution created in Cloudfront?

    Now I just need to figure out how to install the other version W3TC as you have recommended.....

    I might write a summary after this to explain to anybody else with no experience at all how to do this.

  13. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    On the link you gave: http://www.wmiles.com/2013/01/03/w3tc-cache-preload-for-version-0-9-2-5
    it states to update the plugin code, but the code I have in my version (already 9.2.5) is not the same as shown on his page. Doing anything here I might just screw up royally! Pity :(
    So not sure what to do about "Add Expire Headers"

    CDN is still at F but I am guessing thats down to using 10 CDN hostnames which I am not sure how to create.

    Some good news: I found the js culprit (jetpack) causing the page to break in Minify Manual Mode.
    All good on that side now.

    Y Slow rating "B"
    but still F on CDN & E on Expire Headers :(

  14. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    On the link you gave: http://www.wmiles.com/2013/01/03/w3tc-cache-preload-for-version-0-9-2-5
    it states to update the plugin code,

    You can download the whole plugin in a modified version from that very page and replace the existing version. Please read carefully.

    On the bottom of the same page, there is a detailed step by step guide on how to upgrade to the modified version.

    So not sure what to do about "Add Expire Headers"

    Check this guide for some good settings.

    My recommendation for the "preload cache" settings, once you have installed the modified version linked above:

    Garbage Collection Interval: 86400
    Cache Preload Update Interval: 300
    Pages per Interval: 50

  15. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @Thomas - thanks! Think I've been trying too many things and didn't read correctly. I'll get on it as soon as I have a chance. Does this include using multiple CDN hostnames?
    Still struggling a bit setting up a CNAMES - thought I done it but still see the Cloudfront URL in the source code. I'll keep you updated with my developments and hopefully it will benefit others too.
    Thanks again! you're a legend!

  16. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Try this tutorial to set up cnames with your hosting provider, cloudfront and w3c total cache.

    I mentioned it is better to setup 10 cnames, right? This is because wordpress aka total cache will request your files from several different cloudfront servers, not only from one. This adds up to speed again - at least this is what I have read on the web and this is my experience, too.

    I am based in Germany, your website speed feels better already over here. And I am very confident it will work even faster after you have implemented all steps in this thread. But don't trust me - trust pingdom :=)

  17. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @Thomas,

    Looks like I have everything in place and seems to be working well....
    I managed to get the CDN working just fine now. All 10 set up. What I was doing wrong is that I was trying to create a different distribution for each CNAME. So I've created mulptiple CNAMES using the same distribution. PERFECT!!
    Do you know if each CNAME contributes towards a DNS lookup?

    Managed to get my YSLOW rating to A, but CDN still comes up as F - possibly something wrong with my page. I'll need to see what it see. A few facebook widget links (LIKES) which may be causing the problem. I'll see if I can do this manually rather than using the widget.

    Expires have improved to a C rating, so that's good, but I'd liek to get everything to A's - does this make a difference or is the overall Page rating (A) enough?

    But most importantly - thank you so much for all your help!!! I REALLY do appreciate it!

  18. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @acp73 / Anthony,

    My pleasure, Anthony.

    Are you up to complete perfection? Here is one more small and quick step to do:

    Check your site with tools.pingdom.com

    In "waterfall" view, check for all entries that start with http://www.anthonypeyper.com/ . These are items in directories which are still not picked up by cloudfront for some reason.

    In order to get all pictures and elements delivered by amazon, login to your wordpress backend, go to
    performance --> CDN --> scroll down to "advanced", look for the "custom file list box".

    When I look at http://www.anthonypeyper.com/music/wound-up-tight-au-magazine/ in pingdom tools, for example I see

    blog_bg_inner_1358462897.png
    is still delivered from
    http://www.anthonypeyper.com/wp-content/uploads/p4/images/blog_bg_inner_1358462897.png

    To change this, add
    wp-content/uploads/*

    to the custom file list box.

    Do exactly the same with all entries in pingdom waterfall-view that are still delivered via http://www.anthonyheyper.com. Find out in which directories those elements are located and add all those paths to bye custom file list box with a * at the end, just follow the scheme above. You will see that all files will be picked up and delivered by cloud front. This will enhance your site speed even more. (Could be that the line mentioned above catches all those entries already, please double check for yourself).

    By the way, pingdom tools gets you very good marks for your site (95/100). I do not know about Yslow grades, I don't use them. More important to me seems the delivery speed, and pingdom says your pages are being delivered in 1,1 seconds to their Amsterdam service. This is fast. I guess you could go down even a little bit further if you follow the steps described above.

    Let me know how this works for you.

    Oh, and i personally have decided not to use official version 0.9.2.7. This seems to be rather buggy. I do not think our sites will get much faster than we have got them now, anyway.... :=)))

    For all readers of this thread: I think wmiles forked version 0.9.2.5 is the best, fastest, feature richest and most stable version out so far. Check the release notes here and here what the main differences of the official version are.
    Non of wmiles enhancements seem to have been introduced in the official version 0.9.2.7. It is a complete mystery to me why not.

  19. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @wp-fan

    You know what, I actually added that directory to the custom file list box this evening but in my haste I copied and pasted p-content/uploads/* instead of wp-content/uploads/* I have fixed it now.

    I noticed that some of the masthead images in pingdom show up as being from anthonypeyper.com rather than from the CDN - I think this may be that they're part of a rotating banner and maybe only the first image is recorded as loading from the CDN - Do you think this is possible?

    YEAH! I am also totally confused as to why the latest version doesnt include any of the special enhancements you mention above. I'm definitely staying with my beloved ver 0.9.2.5

    Thanks again man! YOU ROCK!

  20. Frederick Townes
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    Be wary of forks, and be careful of those who make changes without working with the original developer of plugins. Every single bug report, code contribution et al are considered and discussed with folks that contribute. Everything mentioned in this thread has not been vetted by me and as a result will break in the future as further improvements, updates and security fixes are applied. The plugin is not in final release (v1.0) which means that no one has yet seen what is planned and what is to be offered to give all of you the same tools, resources and performance as major media companies (which is the intent of this project). While I appreciate that you all are working to help each other, all that I'm saying is that I'd appreciate if you wouldn't assume that I'm not here to work through the concerns with you, I've been working on this for several years for a reason and it's not because this is the end, this is actually still the beginning.

    Sorry for the challenges, again, this project is still not at final release. If you have questions the best place for those is in the support tab of the plugin, not in the forums... yet.

  21. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @Frederick > Sorry if it seems that we're undermining your plugin. That's not the case at all. I just had some issues when updating 9.2.6 so decided to roll back 9.2.5 after reading about more troubles when folk posted that the later version gave even more troubles.

  22. sLa NGjI's
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    For my personal opinion, and maximum respect, the only person that seems we're undermining this plugin is Frederick Townes ... sorry! With WordPress 3.5.1 (latest version) all versione since 0.9.2.4 was reported wrong by wordpress.org users vote system ... sorry again!

    :)

  23. Frederick Townes
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    I don't feel undermined; this is not for me, this is all for you. It's extremely difficult to collect feedback and actually resolve issues using these forums especially when so much needs to be said for people to have the information they need to apply proper judgement. Everyone is free to say whatever they like, as time moves forward so will W3TC. Your loyalty and clear bug reports are appreciated.

  24. sLa NGjI's
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Frederick Townes wrote:

    I don't feel undermined; this is not for me, this is all for you.

    Personally, i am absolutely happy. Indeed, they are even happier since I left W3 Total Cache for the forked version, already at the time of 0.9.2.4: i not only saved by the bug of security db cache, but also by the disaster for three different versions in just two days (0.9.2.6 ~ 8) that apparently seem not yet work properly. And all this even if it blames the WP FileSystem ... The handling of API CloudFlare does not work, and you can not give even blame the WP FileSystem. There are major problems on the management of Opcode, slow performance due to cache db, interference problems with other plugins cron, the function enanched disk only works with certain hosting very lucky, the management of tag Pragma is absolutely beyond any standard now known, the use of the tag in Public-cache control is absolutely unnecessary and not recommended even by google page speed ...

    The new Dashboard in W3 Total Cache is a shareware/serviceware and not an enhachement ... visible only with 1280x1024 pixel without scrolling browser!

    And all this comes from someone who immediately after installing WordPress, installing W3 Total Cache. So much the better WP Super Cache / HyperCache at least what they offer really works without compromise, and without blame the WP FileSystem or difficulty of reading the support forum. To me this seems like yet another excuse to force the service to be paid!

    I'm not going to wait for some version 0.9.2.9 to discover that still does not work again ... and not just me saying this, it seems: wait for the first useful version that actually works fine, and i will try his forked version, make no mistake again.!

    Regards :)

  25. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    To me this seems like yet another excuse to force the service to be paid!

    sLa NGjl's, I personally wouldn't go that far.
    Yes, I do believe that there is a business model behind Frederick Townes developing this plugin. His company w3 edge seems to fund itself offering services related to the plugins functionality to larger companies. And my guess is that this plugin helps demonstrating his competence to existing and potential customers.

    But no, I don't think the flaws in with the latest updates were introduced on purpose. I think Frederick like any software-developer with a business-model behind a "free" version of his software would be ill-advised to put at risk what is most important for the brand of any software: Productivity, reliability and trust.

    That being said, I have one question and one request: :

        Question: Frederick stated in another post that the issues many users report in the forums lately have not appeared within the circle of his paying customers. My conclusion from this statement is that his paying customers work with different setups than a significant part of users in this forum. If this is true, wouldn't it be an obvious idea to enlarge the beta-testing user base and make sure a larger variety of setups are being tested and considered in future beta-testing cycles?
        Request: What I really like (and can't live without) about wmiles tweaked version of w3c total cache is the following functionality:
        Prime caching all pages and posts when server load is low (e.g. around midnight or 2am in the morning)
        Re-priming single pages or posts whenever they are changed or new ones are created
        make the prime cache process in the night independent from cron-calls to make sure all pages and posts have always been fully cached at all times 24/7.

    Frederick mentioned elsewhere this would not work in all setups and environments. Would it be at least possible to make this functionality an option to opt in or out?
    Why I am so passionate about this is because I noticed that priming allposts and pages has made my website so much faster that I am beating most of my competition in my niche when it comes to speed. And this is all what w3c total cache should be (and is, in my opinion) about.

  26. wp-fan
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @acp73

    Looking at pingdom tools, on your staring page there are still some issues:

        wp-content/upload/*
        is still not being picked up by cloudfront
        there are still some Amazon S3 - instances left:
        http://prophoto.s3.amazonaws.com/img/ajaxLoadingSpinner.gif
        this .js file is not in your minify list yet and takes a long time to load
        http://www.anthonypeyper.com/?staticfile=masthead.js&cb=1360502050841

    All summed up, these issues take valuable load time. From what I can tell from pingdom tools, You are loosing around 50% load time (first call from Amsterdam server: 3,xx seconds at the moment).

  27. Teddy Tood
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    Sorry if i add in the queue, it is a bit of time I follow intrigued some of these posts.

    I have read many wp-fan posts who really do not understand.

    First he filled the message forum publicizing the forked version 0.9.2.5 of wmiles, challenging Frederick Townes, then one day he said that he wrote wmiles via email to apply the changes to the version 0.9.2.6 but had not received replies.

    Now it seems to deny wmiles guilty of not making changes requested by him, praising and licking instead Frederick Townes, challenging sLa NGjI always proper critical to W3 Total Cache.

    Make up your mind and take a position rather than acting like a pimp ... :-))

  28. acp73
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    @wp-fan...
    yeah strangely no matter what I do i just cant get "wp-content/upload/*" to be used by cloud front....
    Still all masthead images are detected by CDN either ...:/

    Manually added the js - hope that is sorted now.
    Havent been able to get a test on Pingdom this evening......

  29. AITpro
    Member
    Posted 1 year ago #

    The problem with $hitstorms is that it is hard to see around the turd$ that are smacking you in the face right Frederick? LOL I feel your pain man as do all other plugin developers. The ups and downs of plugin development. Sigh.

    This is just a metaphor. I am not implying anything. ;)

  30. Frederick Townes
    Member
    Plugin Author

    Posted 1 year ago #

    @acp73, can you please submit a bug submission form from the support tab of the plugin?

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